Oh, Canada

[Vonz90]

I'm just curious, does anyone know of an actual case where someone successfully weathered a collapse of society using a stash of gold or whatever?

Yes. 3 stories.

1. German grandmother of a friend - gold coins and gold ring
2. Friend's Greek grandparents - mostly precious gems, but set in gold and platinum
3. Father's friend's father in Japan - mostly silver coins, which took quite a bit of foresight because Japan started debasing their currency about 1925

Outside of USA, time between 1940 and 1946 qualifies as "collapse of society"

Interesting, the cases I am aware of from Eastern Europe and Germany; everybody lost everything including whatever might have been stashed (and their livesi a bunch of cases). I guess there are always exceptions.

[D5CAV]

Interesting, the cases I am aware of from Eastern Europe and Germany; everybody lost everything including whatever might have been stashed (and their livesi a bunch of cases). I guess there are always exceptions.

Trust in the Lord, Timing is everything, and S### happens.

Yes, those stories were recounted by survivors or their offspring. They planned ahead, acted quickly and were lucky. Very lucky. Preparation doesn't guarantee success and dead men tell no tales.

When you see a story of some guy with a metal detector finding a stash of PMs, it's a pretty good guess that whoever made that stash "lost everything".

My investment advice includes "plomo" and iron. PMs, toilet paper, cigarettes and whatever else you are "hoarding" will only serve to enrich "Humungus" or whoever becomes "Emperor of the Wasteland" unless you have some way of keeping them. Even "Plomo" and iron are only tools. You need training and trained friends to properly employ them.

Remember the US Army's first rule of gunfighting "Bring a gun, bring all your friends who have guns, and bring all their friends who have guns."

The "Hildabeest" was right about one thing: "It takes a village" (or squad or platoon or brigade or whatever you can get). Some Armor, Artillery and Air Support won't hurt, either.

[Vonz90]

Interesting, the cases I am aware of from Eastern Europe and Germany; everybody lost everything including whatever might have been stashed (and their livesi a bunch of cases). I guess there are always exceptions.

Trust in the Lord, Timing is everything, and S### happens.

Yes, those stories were recounted by survivors or their offspring. They planned ahead, acted quickly and were lucky. Very lucky. Preparation doesn't guarantee success and dead men tell no tales.

When you see a story of some guy with a metal detector finding a stash of PMs, it's a pretty good guess that whoever made that stash "lost everything".

My investment advice includes "plomo" and iron. PMs, toilet paper, cigarettes and whatever else you are "hoarding" will only serve to enrich "Humungus" or whoever becomes "Emperor of the Wasteland" unless you have some way of keeping them. Even "Plomo" and iron are only tools. You need training and trained friends to properly employ them.

Remember the US Army's first rule of gunfighting "Bring a gun, bring all your friends who have guns, and bring all their friends who have guns."

The "Hildabeest" was right about one thing: "It takes a village" (or squad or platoon or brigade or whatever you can get). Some Armor, Artillery and Air Support won't hurt, either.

Yeah, and you probably don't have that. My extended family lived through 3 or 4 social collapses from 1918-1945 depending on if you want to count the Russian revolutionand the Latvian war of independence separately. (The 1930s were kind of a shit show too really). No one saved much above the shirts on the backs. When shit went down, the ones who GTFO right away had a chance and those who did not were killed. It did not matter what was stashed if you have to bug out with nothing.

This is not to say I am against preparing for contingencies. Just that wrapping one's life around it is not useful. Preparing for the extreme end makes less sense because the events make survival too random.

To echo your one point, the biggest difference is are you in a high or low trust society. The family members who did best (or had the least drama) bugged out of Eastern Europe all together after event one (for the Netherlands, England, Australia). My great grandfather did a monumental job of keeping things together and was one of the few who kept most of his property intact; but by the end of the 30s he still had lost it and by '45 he was dead in a soviet concentration camp (great grandmother did not know for sure until mid 50s.)

Interesting side note, a historian family member found the oreder for his execution when the Soviet archives opened up. He was a Russian calvary officer in WW1 so they convicted him of desertion for leaving his unit in 1918, of course his unit ceased to exist at the time but it was a reason I suppose.

[D5CAV]

Yeah, and you probably don't have that. My extended family lived through 3 or 4 social collapses from 1918-1945 depending on if you want to count the Russian revolutionand the Latvian war of independence separately.

I have a few friends with guns who I train with not frequently enough. Could I muster a brigade? No, but maybe a platoon between friends and family. Regarding Armor, Artillery and Air Support, you seem like a smart guy. I'm sure you could figure something out between a visit to Home Depot, the local airfield and the drone store. There's a reason US Navy doesn't use 16" guns anymore. Think a little outside the box.

You and I aren't so different. One grandfather died in an internment camp during WW2. It wasn't German and he wasn't Jewish. He thought he was a successful, well connected businessman. I'm pretty sure to his dying day, he thought "I'm a good citizen. This is all a terrible mistake. One of my business partners will talk to the authorities and get me out of this." Which is how most Americans view the "benevolent" us.gov

Could he have gone somewhere else if he acted quicker? Maybe or maybe not.

Most of my "stash" is "plomo" and iron. I have a few PMs, but I doubt I will ever use them. They are more to hand to my kids and relatives to maybe buy their way onto a freighter out of the US when the time comes.

For me? As Josey Wales said "I got nowhere to go." I hope I'm still strong enough to pick up an old piece of iron and throw some "plomo". If they don't want to live with me, they can die with me.

You decide what you want to do and prepare accordingly.

[blackeagle603]

/threadjack/ I'll repost over on the Ukraine thread but had this thought (again) reading this thread.

Looking at the 40km(?) long Russian column enroute to Kiev.

How would you play that as the Resistance as they approach. I'm no grunt, just an old airedale but i imaging the goal would be to reduce their ammo, fuel and Comms?

[D5CAV]

Looking at the 40km(?) long Russian column enroute to Kiev.

How would you play that as the Resistance as they approach. I'm no grunt, just an old airedale but i imaging the goal would be to reduce their ammo, fuel and Comms?

A few points:

1. I am not the resistance. If they stay off my lawn, I really don't care. I mean, really. Do you think Vlad's minions will insist it's OK for boys to dress up as girls and assault my daughter in the girls bathroom at her high school? I doubt they could do worse than our "woke" government.

2. The first book we got to read at AOAC was Sun Tzu's "Art of War". One of his rules is "be like water". The Taliban must have read this, but our own leadership forgot it. If this was the bad old days and I had my little CAV troop (about 200 men, 15 M2s, 12 M1s and 3 4.2" mortars in tracks, plus associated ash and trash) facing that Russian column, I would run. Retreat is sometimes a very smart tactical move. What I do with my own life is one thing, but I have a responsibility to my men.

3. If you stay off my lawn and don't tell me what I can read, drink, or think, I don't care what flag you carry. If you come to my house to take me, my family, or my "stash", then it is "game on". I don't care if the flag on your shoulder is the Russian, US, or LAPD.

[Vonz90]

Looking at the 40km(?) long Russian column enroute to Kiev.

How would you play that as the Resistance as they approach. I'm no grunt, just an old airedale but i imaging the goal would be to reduce their ammo, fuel and Comms?

A few points:


3. If you stay off my lawn and don't tell me what I can read, drink, or think, I don't care what flag you carry. If you come to my house to take me, my family, or my "stash", then it is "game on". I don't care if the flag on your shoulder is the Russian, US, or LAPD.

The Ukrainians know what being ruled by Russia looks like and it isn't pretty.

Remember duty first, and resisting foreign invasion is pretty high on the list of duties. By the time you know they are an issue for your little clan, it is too late.

[D5CAV]

The Ukrainians know what being ruled by Russia looks like and it isn't pretty.

Remember duty first, and resisting foreign invasion is pretty high on the list of duties. By the time you know they are an issue for your little clan, it is too late.

Like I said. You decide what you will do and prepare accordingly.

If that means brushing up on your Ukrainian and going to Kiev, then good luck. I understand they are handing out GI AK47s with the happy switch to anyone who shows up, so you can leave your home-built parts-kit, semi-only AK at home.

Regarding Ukraine, I don't have a dog in that fight. I don't care.

Regarding Canada, I care a little more because I have friends there and I visit there occasionally.

However, the bigger issue with Canada, is that it is a little close to home, both geographically and politically.

A Russian column coming through my neighborhood is not a scenario I'm planning for.

Some young, attractive, "woke" idiot who manages to get elected to office in my state who (like Trudeau) admires the "efficiency" of China's regime and decides to suspend US BOR "for the greater good", is a possible scenario.

That scenario is a problem for me. Now I care.

[Vonz90]

The Ukrainians know what being ruled by Russia looks like and it isn't pretty.

Remember duty first, and resisting foreign invasion is pretty high on the list of duties. By the time you know they are an issue for your little clan, it is too late.

Like I said. You decide what you will do and prepare accordingly.

If that means brushing up on your Ukrainian and going to Kiev, then good luck. I understand they are handing out GI AK47s with the happy switch to anyone who shows up, so you can leave your home-built parts-kit, semi-only AK at home.

Regarding Ukraine, I don't have a dog in that fight. I don't care.

Regarding Canada, I care a little more because I have friends there and I visit there occasionally.

However, the bigger issue with Canada, is that it is a little close to home, both geographically and politically.

A Russian column coming through my neighborhood is not a scenario I'm planning for.

Some young, attractive, "woke" idiot who manages to get elected to office in my state who (like Trudeau) admires the "efficiency" of China's regime and decides to suspend US BOR "for the greater good", is a possible scenario.

That scenario is a problem for me. Now I care.

The discussion is abstract, no one is suggesting that you (or I) go there to fight now. It is what if.

[Netpackrat]

3. If you stay off my lawn and don't tell me what I can read, drink, or think, I don't care what flag you carry. If you come to my house to take me, my family, or my "stash", then it is "game on". I don't care if the flag on your shoulder is the Russian, US, or LAPD.

I don't know if they care what you drink, but the Russian government is pretty far gone on your other criteria, and that's just where its own people are concerned. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out how they would treat you as an army of conquest/occupation.