Recommendations for rifle glass?

[Weetabix]

I've picked the rifle; now I need the glass.

I'd like to keep it under $700 or so. I'd like a useful reticule that won't obscure targets at distance. I'd like to be able to shoot at a man-size targets at 400 yards(?).

I'd like clarity over magnification, I think. Thoughts on that?

Magnification range? I think I'd prefer the low end around 1.5 or 2 because I like a large field of view, but I'm just thinking here. Thoughts?

Manufacturers to consider? Zeiss? Burris? Leoupold? Vortex?

Manufacturer's to avoid?

Do I pick the rings after I've picked the scope, or is that an independent decision?

[Weetabix]

I've picked the rifle; now I need the glass.

I'd like to keep it under $700 or so. I'd like a useful reticule that won't obscure targets at distance. I'd like to be able to shoot at a man-size targets at 400 yards(?).

I'd like clarity over magnification, I think. Thoughts on that?

Magnification range? I think I'd prefer the low end around 1.5 or 2 because I like a large field of view, but I'm just thinking here. Thoughts?

Manufacturers to consider? Zeiss? Burris? Leoupold? Vortex?

Manufacturer's to avoid?

Do I pick the rings after I've picked the scope, or is that an independent decision?

ETA: Oh, yeah - and where do I look for good deals? Optics Planet? Camera Land NY? Others?

[blackeagle603]

Sounds like a 2x7 might be a good balance for you. I like having a low mag available -- maybe because I grew up hunting in SW WA woods.

IMHO, hard to beat the value of a Burris or Vortex. Actually, I think I'm understating that quite a bit. Just checked and see 2x7 Burris Fullfield on Amazon for under $160.

The trickle down in technology and reliability has made some really fine scopes available at lower prices. I'd venture a guess you get more scope for $150-200 these days than we got for $3-400 20 years ago.

For my Model 70's I've got a bias toward Leupolds. I suppose that's for old times sake, more a matter or sentiment than anything else. Though I do like their warranty and their PNW roots.

[rightisright]

I'll second the Vortex recommendation. I think they are the best deal going these days. And they have a no questions asked lifetime warranty. Even if you accidentally run it over with your truck, they will replace it.

Another good bang for the buck these days is Sightron.

[Aesop]

I'd like to be able to shoot at a man-size targets at 400 yards(?).

With all due respect Weet, if you need a scope to hit a man sized target at 400 yards, you need to skip the scope, and take a good basic marksmanship class.
Because the proper scope for man-sized targets out to 400 yards is called "iron sights".
(2 MOA @ 400 yds = approx. a 16" circle, i.e. the size of the avg. human torso). Two MOA with iron sights at that range is rack-grade accuracy from decent surplus military rifles.
Unless the target(s) are running at the time, and there's a 40 knot crosswind.
At night.


If you're thinking of hitting minute-of-headshot on a man-sized target at 400 yards, then some glass might be in order.

At which point my default would be Leupold, and for bang-for-the-buck economy, their AR grade scopes.
$375 MSRP for a 3-9x40mm, a plethora of reticle options, and BDC rings available for multiple calibers through their Custom Shop.
Get the lowest rings that will allow the objective bell to clear the weapon, and for far less than your notional $700, you'll have more accuracy than you're liable to be able to exploit in a sturdy, reliable, and high-quality scope.

You're done.

Except not quite.

Now take another $500-700, buy quality ammunition of the type, load, and bullet weight you anticipate using, and learn to shoot the gorram weapon in multiple positions, in varying winds, from dawn to dusk, in any weather, on the silhouettes the size of your intended target usage.
Keep a data book to learn your windage and elevation clicks in all those varied conditions.
You can only learn this by shooting a few hundred rounds as outlined above.
Otherwise, you're just screwing around, and would be better off with a shotgun, and some homemade molotovs.

Learn the ballistics of the round you're shooting, and you'll probably find that if you zero it at 300 yards, you'll be able to hit a man-sized target in vital areas anywhere from 0-400 yards by aiming center-mass, even if you can't tell distance for spit.

Then learn how to estimate range, and get a decent ranging laser.
Then learn holdovers for your 300-yd zero at farther ranges.
(And put them on a laminated cheat sheet on the stock of your weapon.)

Then you're dangerous out to 600-800 yards or more without breaking a sweat.
Now you're done.
And the Gunny approves of your efforts.

[PawPaw]

With all due respect Weet, if you need a scope to hit a man sized target at 400 yards, you need to skip the scope, and take a good basic marksmanship class.

That was probably true for me when I was in my 20s, 30s and 40s, but with aging eyes and the dynamics of distance and iron sights, I wouldn't have a .22 rifle that didn't have glass on it. My eyes demand glass for anything over handgun distances.

However, I believe that the glass we have available today is light-years better than the glass we had even 30 years ago. For out to 400 yards, any of the half-way decent glass from Leupold, Burris, Vortex, or any one of the other pretenders would suffice. I'd keep the cost down to about $250.00 and be just fine with it. Now that I think about it, the Nikon ProStaff I have on my .30-06 would do just fine, and Midway has it on sale right now.

[Netpackrat]

Speaking of hold overs, both Leupold and Burris will make custom dials for certain models of their scopes, that are calibrated to your load.

http://www.leupold.com/resources/custom-dial-system/

http://www.burrisoptics.com/scopes/c4-p ... pes-series

And the Leupold Custom Shop can do custom reticles, etc.

https://customshop.leupold.com/

Iron sight skills are still crucial, but you might as well give yourself every unfair advantage that you can.

Edit: I notice now that Aesop already mentioned the custom shop.

[Durham68]

I think you are on the right track prioritizing clarity over magnification, but with a budget of $700 I think you can have a healthy dose of both.

ETA: The FOV on a 3x scope is still huge.

[Weetabix]

Aesop,

Valuable comments all, and all in the plan. I definitely want Gunny to approve.

But with regard to iron sights - see PawPaw's comments. I was at the range shooting 50 yard with iron sights recently. I was keeping decent groups, but only because I knew where the target was. I couldn't actually see the bull. That's what told me it was time for glass. The scope is for seeing out past 50-100 yards more than for the marksmanship concerns.

[Weetabix]

I like the Vortex "run over it with your truck" warranty.

So, what do you think of these:

Vortex at Midway, less than $300.

Particularly:
Vortex Diamondback HP Rifle Scope 3-12x 42mm Side Focus Matte
Vortex Crossfire II Rifle Scope 2-7x 32mm Dead-Hold BDC Reticle Matte
Vortex Crossfire II Rifle Scope 3-9x 40mm V-Plex Reticle Matte
Vortex Crossfire II Rifle Scope 3-9x 50mm Matte
Vortex Diamondback Rifle Scope 3-9x 40mm Plex Reticle Matte
Vortex Diamondback Rifle Scope 2-7x 35mm Dead-Hold BDC Reticle Matte

I'm looking at lower than 4 as the low magnification and skipping the ones with worse reviews. I like a larger objective for more light. I haven't begun figuring out reticules. Not sure yet how side focus is better or worse than twist focus. Have to run an errand, so I'll try to edit this to put links in later.