gah, Head Gasket.

[Aglifter]

Montero's are nifty trucks. A head gasket shouldn't make you lose the oil... If ignored, the water contamination could wreck the engine.

[TheIrishman]

I assumed the loss of gasket caused loss of oil which caused damage to the engine. Then again, I am not a mechanic, nor do I play one on TV.

A head gasket shouldn't make you lose the oil... If ignored, the water contamination could wreck the engine.

+1
If the gasket tears from water jacket to cylinder, it will usually blow the coolant out the exhaust as steam. It is not good to drive that way, as the coolant washes down the cylinder bore and will eat piston rings soon enough(ethylene glycol/water is not a lubricant). If it tears in a spot allowing the coolant to reach the oil, you'll soon be pumping brown sludge out your PCV. In the oiling system, it will eat rod and main bearing(again, not a lubricant).

As to the head, the damage is directly related to how hot the engine got before you realized the gasket was blown and how long it stayed there. If you were to do the gaskets, it's little more than a milling job to true them up. Haven't had a set milled in a few years, but last time was about $200/each. Mind you that was to have them angle milled for higher compression, so just straightening them up might be cheaper. You should have them checked for cracks as well if you plan to go that route.

Given the Montero's reputation for overbuilt drivetrains, it may just be worth it to fix rather than scrap.

[blackeagle603]

Been playing phone tag from Taiwan with my mechanic -- slow going. Just off the phone with him.

Working out the numbers on a couple other possibilities.

Fwd'd him a link to a Japanese import engine with 55K on it to see if it's suitable. That'd be about another $500 than the 125K mile engine he located. He's nervous about those "take-outs" since sometimes there are surprises with different brackets or mounting in the Japanese market models.

Have him getting quote/confirming details on a full overhaul with a rebuilder up in Sacramento he uses. Thinks that'd put the total bill up to ~$5000-5500 but he thinks it would have a 3yr/100K warranty on the longblock.

either way this is going to hurt.

[MiddleAgedKen]

Was the oil emulsified?

What would it cost to get a rebuilt head only?

It's been a looooong time, but I replaced a head gasket on an '84 S-15 with the (2.8L 60°, string of expletives deleted) V6. It actually went pretty well, and I am an average (at best) wrench-twister.

[308Mike]

Message sent to my brother along with your contact phone numbers. I just spoke to him to let him know about the email. If he doesn't contact you directly, I'll let you know what he has to say (he's been pretty booked lately). When I mentioned your truck, he said (without any prompting); "they have some funky engines". When I said I'd heard they had some beefy drive train stuff, he only grunted in a kinda' agreement. I told him your direct email address was in the body of the email (he's not a big computer person unless it pertains to vehicles).

Let me know what he has to say if he contacts you directly (he might be overworked and looking to dump it but won't refer you to anyone he doesn't trust).

[blackeagle603]

I'm not going to put the money into a head job on a bottomend with 192K on it. I don't know what the oil looks like. This failed as I was heading out on business travel to Asia. I haven't seen the vehicle and am just communicating in snippets with the mechanic across an 8 hr time difference.

In these overhead cam engines, much more of the cost of an overhaul is in the heads.
A head job (V-6) runs about $1800 -- if the heads can be salvaged and I don't need to buy a core.

This "paying for labor" thing is a killer when you've spent a lifetime of DIY.

Options and total cost estimates being considered:
1.[strike]$1800 headjob[/strike]
2. R&R with a 125K used engine ~$3400 (2002 engine w/ confirmed compatibility)
3. R&R with a 55K used engine ~$3900 (1997/same year engine, trying to confirm compatibility of this imported Japan Engine)
4. Send engine to rebuilder in Sacramento ?$5000-5500? (waiting for quote and warranty info. May be a 100K/3 year engine)

5. Scrap and replace with a "new" used vehicle under $5K
5a. sell straight to dismantler. Collect $500-700
5b. Scrap and part out vehicle on my own. Collect $2K-3K from body parts, trans/transfer case, axles/diffs, tires. Deal with prolonged mess, hassle, haggling, wife unhappy about slow resolution of increasing mess on our lot.

[evan price]

First, your mechanic is totally trying to F*ck you over on price.

Even granted it's a 4x4 a motor R&R on this is no more than 16 hours plus materials for a well equipped shop. It's tight under the hood but nowhere near as bad as the Trooper IIs of the same time frame and loads better than Isuzu Rodeo/Honda Passport. I'm nowhere near you but I typically charge between $500-$850 labor plus parts and the cost of the motor.

Given it's California but the price is ridiculous.

As long as it's out I would personally recommend on a junkyard motor changing the water pump, spark plugs & tuneup parts, all fluids & filters, and the timing belt (if equipped).

Second, he's adding a HEFTY markup to the motor.

check out www.car-part.com and you can search member salvage yards right down to state and zipcode as you desire for someone with the same motor, including mileage.

Since you are in CA and I don't know CA I checked the Las Vegas area search which includes CA, NV, AZ, UT, etc.

There's a guy in Modesto CA with a 98K mile motor for $900 out of a 2000 Montero. A guy in Fontane CA with one for $900 out of a 1998 with 56,500 on it. There's a yard in Wilmington with TWO of them, a 2000 and a 2001, one with 102K and one with 119 k miles on them, for $1000 each and I bet since that's the internet price and they have two, they would probably deal with you on a cash price. Rancho Cordova CA shows a yard with two of them for $1100 each, one with only 87K on it...again, would probably deal on price.

Kar King Auto in Ontario CA lists complete rebuild motors with a 6 month warranty for $2000 exchange.

It's worth shopping around.

You might also try to find some smaller shops that need the work more and who might be willing to work with you on price.

Your guy sounds like he knows you are over a barrel being out of country and is willing to work you over because of it.

Third, your truck's Blue Book Value is maybe $2500-$3000 on a very good day.

While the considerations of lower insurance and stuff are quite valid; it is also worth thinking about spending more than the truck's worth to fix it, versus buying something similar. I know that dealer retail for a NICE Montero is low enough that you could find a good used identical truck with half the miles for less than $5000. These were never really popular in the US and values are low because of that.

Whatever you choose, good luck.

Were it mine- I'd throw a junkyard motor in it myself. Obviously, you can't do it yourself. Next best thing is to find a hungry small shop and wave some cash in their noses. I bet you could find Juan & Carlos' garage on a back alley and they'd do it real fast and cheap. This isn't a Lamborghini, it's a Mitsubishi, and they were designed and built to be serviced by normal people. Get a quality junkyard takeout motor that is complete and in running condition, and all you have to do is bolt it in and reconnect what's disconnected. The parts are all there already in running condition. A *good* junkyard pulls the motor without damaging parts, and unplugs the wiring harness from the ECM under the dash instead of cutting it so the wiring is a snap. (That's how I do them, anyway.)

[blackeagle603]

15 hours quoted for the job. Local shop rates are $90-95/hour unless you go to the ghetto or find someone who will work it as a side job. That'll still run you $65/hour.

Thanks for the leads on used engines. I always work him on parts and out shop him. He's not so hot searching online and is paranoid about liability for what he proposes other than OEM parts. The State car repair board is insane and plays all sorts of entrapment games in the name of protecting the consumer. You really can't imagine it if you're not from CA. All they've done is double the cost of any repair and drive shops out of business. I'm one of the few customers he'll talk openly with. Even so I've learned if I shop it and propose it then he'll has license to ease up and go with it.

[evan price]

Around here $95 an hour is the main line dealer repair rate not a private shop. $65/hr is more normal over here.

I am once again glad I am not living over in Kalifornia.

[blackeagle603]

Back stateside late last night. Up and out this morning to take a look/commit to a plan for the Montero.

Checked in with a smaller shop in a Spring Valley low rider neighborhood. $80/hr shop rate. Owner has a beautiful old Chevelle. The shop's busy but pretty orderly. His brother runs the body shop next door and is doing a rocking business. Looks like one bay keeps busy with engine swaps. One in progress and several long blocks queued up on the side.

Took less than 3 minutes for him to call a used engine source and quote me -- no fishing around. Clearly does a lot of this type work. Quoted $2300 installed (less consumables, new seals, belts as needed) for a 85K mile engine tested with 165-175# on all cylinders. I turned him loose on it. We'll see how it goes. You payz yer money and you takes yer chancez. Thinking I'll have him plumb in/mount an external oil filter while it's apart. The skid plate makes routine oil changes a pain.