Troubleshooting guns and groups

[Combat Controller]

So, went to the range last night, I took my Delta Elite 10mm 5", my Norinco .45 5", my Kimber Royal Carry CCO 4" .45, my S&W 1911PD Nighthawk .45 4.25", and my Wilson Combat CCO 4" .45.

I shot five shots out of each at 7 yards, as fast as I could reacquire the target. My goal was to troubleshoot my groups. It seems I am still shooting low and to the left, except with a .22 which I drilled 10 rounds through before I took the targets off, rapid fire. Judging from the groups I get a wider spread with the lightweight guns, natch, but I find it interesting that the 10mm (also 200 gr) is getting better ones than the Norinco, and none of them as good as the Wilson, which has tiny sights, smaller grip and shorter barrel.... All have flat backstraps and long triggers, the two 5" 1911's have stock beavertails. I think the extended beaver with speedbump is one of the smarter improvements to the platform.

So, it makes one wonder, is it the equipment, or the shooter at this stage? I will have to expand this experiment, but it is an interesting start....


Golden Bullet 200 gr

LSWC 200 gr

Both using 6.8 gr of Unique .

[D5CAV]

Have you shot your pistols from a Ransom rest?

[esa5444]

Have Ms. G&T shoot the guns. When she shoots a quarter sized group at 15 yards, you'll know that you are the problem.

[Whirlibird]

Where do they shoot slow-fire in comparison?
The differences between the small grip and the larger grips may be a point.
The beavertail may be allowing you to get more thumb on the weapon and keep you from rolling your pistol left/down.
By firing fast you are likely not concentrating on putting the needed thumb pressure on the weapon to prevent the above.
I would hazard a guess that you are sub-consciously gripping the 10mm and CCO harder because of the recoil and therefore not having the same issue.
Personally the humped grip safety is an abomination and effects my shooting dramatically in a negative fashion. But that's just me.

[Combat Controller]

Have you shot your pistols from a Ransom rest?

Nope, I need to put them on a rest and take pics, but honestly, I think they will all shoot the same. WB makes some good points about my grip and thumb pressure. I have always just shot, fairly well usually, but recently I have decided I can always shoot better and am trying to troubleshoot the problems. I may also have developed a flinch indoors, I caught myself doing it at least once, hence the long flyer/s in the upper right side.

[Aglifter]

Do any feel better to you? More secure grip, etc? Personally, I always like the most aggressive checkering I can get, but lifting stones, etc tends to make my hands a bit rougher than most. If I shoot something w.o. that checkering, even though I'm getting an adequate grip, I don't feel as confident.

[Combat Controller]

Well, other than the light weight, which is easy to carry but "feels" wrong when shooting, they all are set up fairly the same, with the exception of the beaver tails. I am starting to sit solidly in the camp of needing one for my personal accuracy. The Wilson is the best, along with the S&W, but one is a commander the other a CCO. The Kimber is a lightweight CCO, so the groups were a bit more spread. I ought to run them all again tonight to double check, and only after shooting for a bit to warm up.

[Aglifter]

I believe SVI makes a Tungsten guide rod that should fit the lightweights -- if you want think some more muzzle weight might help.

[Combat Controller]

I have a Tungsten rod in the Kimber, but I prefer the GI setup of the commander. I had no choice with the Kimber due to the bull barrel exant.

[Factfind]

CC I have found almost without exception that when I am shooting low and left it is because I don't have enough finger on the trigger. Try it.