First Handgun

[cu74]

how high is astronomical? i have spotted a number of them on gunbroker, including the one I linked to, for in the $800 range. Not cheap, but as many will point out you simply cant make a revolver like that and sell it for that price anymore. Also, gunbroker prices tend to run a little high, so maybe i can find one locally for a little cheaper...

Also, in 27 vs Python, the 27 comes out on top for you? Thats high praise for the 27. Everything I've ever read about Pythons makes them out to be the rolls royce of revolvers

I use "astronomical" as a relative term. I haven't bought any revolvers lately, but not long ago one could get a variety of "J" and "K" Frame Smiths, (Models 10, 13, 15, 586, 686, etc.) for under $400, and the "N" Frame Model 28 for only slightly more. At the same time Model 27s were going for $600 and up. With the apparently ever-increasing price for quality handguns, I'd guess $800 may not be too bad today.

I guess I would more properly apply the "astronomical" term to the Colt Pythons. At the time I was buying Smiths in the price ranges above, Pythons (and Diamondbacks as well) were going for even more. It was difficult to find a Python for less than $1,000 that wasn't at least cosmetically challenged - mine have substantial holster wear. Given the general price differences between the Smiths and the Colts, it appears there are lots of folks reading the same stuff you read.

My preference for the Model 27 over the Python does not mean I don't think highly of Pythons. The Colt revolvers are perhaps marginally better designed than the Smiths - Colt's famous "bank-vault" lock-up is certainly impressive and indicative of precision tolerances. However, that same precise fit is probably the reason for the stories about Colts being "delicate" or not holding up well in heavy use, since they are reportedly less forgiving of normal wear and tear. That said, I think everyone should have at least one Python, (it's as close to owning a Rolls Royce that most of us will get).

I prefer the Smith trigger action to that of the Colt, and that's enough for me to rate the Model 27 above the Python. My 27-0 is almost fifty years old, so it was built back when craftsmanship was valued at S&W. The fit and finish compare quite well with that of my Pythons. Given the premium prices commanded for Pythons, I believe the Model 27 is a much better value for the money. Should I ever have to sell off my revolvers, the 27-0 will be the last to go.

[MarkD]

I don't know about the WW I 1911, the changes made were made for a reason. In particular the tiny sights may be problematic for you (then again my eyes are much older than yours). I'd try to shoot one first and see if you get bitten too, if so get an updated model.

I don't think you ever go wrong with a S&W revolver. I don't have any personal experience with the 27, but I have a 617 (.22 LR) and 686 (.357 mag) and love them both. If I were doing it over now I might be more inclined to go with blue instead of stainless, then I was more concerned with maintenance than looks.

Have you considered a good .22 instead? Not much for self defense, but if you shoot a lot you'll save the price of the gun in ammo.

[Evyl Robot]

I would suggest a S&W wheelie, one way or another. Models 27, 29, 581, or 586 would serve you well. If this will be a carrier, go for a sub-4-inch barrel. If it is to be a range/house gun, go for 5-inch or longer. OBTW, my first gun ever, hand or long, is a factory-engraved S&W M29. *Homer Simpson drooling sounds*

http://www.smith-wesson.com/webapp/wcs/ ... sFirearm=Y

OBTW, Beauty just barely fits in the budget that you have stated with the real-life shelf prices I've seen on it.

--Michael

[1911Man]

As much as I love 1911's, you can't go wrong with an N-frame Smith. It takes a lot of the recoil out of the .357. .38 Spl's are quite pleasant. S&W 686's are nice too, just a smaller frame.

WRT S&W vs. Colt, I've owned both (Anaconda, not Python) and while the Colt is a very fine pistol, I prefer the S&W. The triggers are like glass. In SA mode, the trigger pull is light enough to make every shot a "suprise shot" that helps avoid flinching. I've never had a problem with any of my S&W's that wasn't due to operator error. I wouldn't mind owning a Python, but I don't feel cheated at not owning one either.

[eocoolj]

Thanks for all the input. It sounds like the general consensus is the 27. Here's a question, what is significance of the suffix number (27-1, 27-2, etc)? I assume different series or production runs? Is there any one in particular I would want to try to get? Any to avoid?

[cu74]

Thanks for all the input. It sounds like the general consensus is the 27. Here's a question, what is significance of the suffix number (27-1, 27-2, etc)? I assume different series or production runs? Is there any one in particular I would want to try to get? Any to avoid?

The "suffix number" denotes engineering and Production Changes. For example, this from The Standard Catalog of Smith & Wesson :

Prior to 1957, the Model 27 was called The 357 Magnum
- 27-no dash (1957) stamping of model number started (This is also referred to as the 27-0)
- 27-1 (1960): Change extractor rod, right hand to left hand thread
- 27-2 (1961): Cylinder stop changed, eliminated trigger guard screw. (1968) Deleted diamond grip. (1969) Changed to "N" serial number prefix.
etc., etc.,etc. through 27-7

Some folks prefer the pinned barrel and counter-bored cylinder, (eliminated with the 27-3 in 1982) so pinned and recessed means you're looking for a 27-0, 27-1 or 27-2. If you want a "Four Screw", you will have to get a 27-0 or 27-1.

As far as I know, there is no Model 27 NOT to get. S&W didn't start putting MIM parts into revolvers until 1997, well after the Model 27 was discontinued in 1994. You can expect to pay a bit more for the "Four Screw" and for the pinned and recessed, merely because they are more in demand for their "extra" features. I wouldn't turn down a Model 27 no matter what the dash number is .

[eocoolj]

I definitely want a pinned and recessed model, but what is the significance of a 4 screw example?

Also, another question, in looking at all the 27s on gunbroker, i've noticed that they seem to have one of two styles of grip. One type looks i bit larger than the other. Here are links to two guns to show what i mean:

Large
Small

I prefer the look of the smaller grips, though I imagine the larger grips provide a better hold on the gun. Will both style grips mount to the same frame? If i found a 27 locally with the larger grips, would i be able to purchase the smaller type grips and put them on myself?

[Whirlibird]

Nuts, my first reply got tanked.
Here goes again.

The Model 27's are an excellent choice, built to last a lifetime or four of .38 loads and more .357's than most people would like to fire.
If you can find one with the checkered rear sight, with the checkered top strap and the S-prefix serial number (on the butt) you're getting a most excellent choice.
If you can get a pre-27, even better.

I'd probably get a Model 28 though, the matte finish would be more appropriate (to me) for a first and only handgun that might get banged around in the wilds and while carried, but that's me. I'd try and find a suitable 27 later to complete the collection though.

My only real complaint about both the 27 and 28, is the short cylinder. It can't take some of the longer and heavier 173/180 gr bullets with them properly seated into the crimping groove.
It's a little thing but a thing none the less. That hasn't prevented me owning half a dozen 27/28's over the years. If I ran across another 27/28 with a decent price tag, I'd easily pick one up.

The Colt Python, my personal favorite .357 wheelgun. I wouldn't get rid of mine for a stack of cash large enough to choke Rosie O'Donnell.
The Colt lockwork is designed to be 'soft' to wear the replaceable parts rather than the expensive large parts. With normal "range" use, you'd still be hard pressed to wear a Python out using .38 loads. This is the last .357 that I'd ever get rid of.

If I were looking for a "first" and collectable piece, I'd look heavily into the Smith Model 24 aka 1950 chambered for .44 Special. There are no flies on the .44 Special when chambered for a heavy N-frame wheelgun. There are decent loads available as well as the cowboy level loads so one can fire it much like a comparable .38. The early 1980's 24 and 624 remakes were good handguns and are occasionally found for decent prices. They were "limited" number weapons @2500/3000 of each, can't remember the exact number but they only lack the pinned and recessed of the earlier models, the quality is excellent.

The USFA SAA's are the best made today. Better than Colt made and cheaper. However not my choice if I'm going to spend that kind of money. I'd hold out for a Freedom Arms Model 97 (Premier grade is all that's made) in either .44 Special or .45 Colt.
Strong enough to load up to respectable levels, disgustingly accurate and easy to pack around. They are the premier non-colt single action.

As far as 1911's go, the Colt Retro 1911 is a very good piece, and for the money a good deal.
However I'd probably pick up a Caspain retro-1911 frame and slide and have a true custom built in 1911 fashion with a handful of improvements. Like an A1 grip safety, Bar-Sto barrel, and high end parts all the way through.

[Joe ex PNG]

Hmmm- ever concider the S&W model 25 in .45 ACP? Or 625 in stainless. Cool, but hard to find used (wonder why that is?)

[eocoolj]

Hmmm- ever concider the S&W model 25 in .45 ACP? Or 625 in stainless. Cool, but hard to find used (wonder why that is?)

So, i go to gunbroker and look for a 25. This is the first gun that comes up. Sweet mother, that is a beautiful gun. I'm guessing the 25 is in a bit less demand than the 27? I feel like a gun in that condition should be more than $800. Props to the seller for taking such great pics too.

Are all the N frames external dimensions the same? Are all the Ns from a given era completed to the same level of fit and finish?