The Gun Counter

I was wondering how difficult it would be to convert one of the folding stock Mosberg MVP .223 bolt actions into .25/45 Sharps?
You would have your choice of AR-15 magazines 5/10/20/30 rounds and something that would be legal for deer in a lot of states. Also for Texas size deer it out to be OK and an easy rifle to get in and out of a vehicle or motor cycle saddle bag.

Looks like just a rebarrel.
But what do you gain over a more available choice such as 6.8 or .300BO?
In your opinion that is.

Well I don't see a whole magnitude of increase in performance but the conversion would seem to be cheaper. No need to for a different bolt face, no need for special magazines, though I wouldn't go cheap on the mags, and you get a performance that is not to far off from a short barreled .243. The Mossberg MVP series uses a jam nut system so the problem is just hunting down a barrel. I think there are a couple of outfits already making various calibers for it but until I win the lottery I don't want to look too hard.
You can get ammo from Sharps but if you are in a place where you can't mail order it looks like you'll need a hand loading set up.
I'd like to see what terminal ballistics would be like with a FMJ bullet.

Looks like the main appeal is absolutely everything stays the same (from a .223 AR) except the barrel. Simple, cheap.

From links I've seen, the people pushing it have really cheesy trying-way-too-hard marketing. No, it's not 'developed from' the .257 Roberts, though we can be charitable and say that was an influence and inspiration.

Had a conversation with a co-worker once. He said that he had an idea for a great wildcat, should be an instant hit.

I said "Bobby, it's already been done."

He said "No, it hasn't and I can't understand why. It should be a great round."

I said "Okay, what is it?

He said "Neck a .308 case down to .277 diameter. I tell you, it will be a barnburner!"

I chuckled, and said "Google .270 Redding."

He hasn't spoken to me since, and that was five years ago.

If I had a lathe (and a shop)I'd like to "reinvent" the original Spanish CETME 7.92 bullet as a .25 round. IIRC the 7.92 was based on the 7.92 Kurtz used in the original German assault rifles. The bullet was two part, the front part was a long streamlined aluminum ogive and the base was jacketed lead(?). It made for a light bullet that could be fired at high velocity out the short case but one that had a high BC for its weight so that it would retain velocity. Also it was reported to be controllable on full auto.
I imagine the terminal effects were nasty as I believe the bullets would have a tendency to flip when they hit anything relatively soft, the base being heavier than the nose.
The Spanish went with the NATO 7.62 X 51 ammunition and redesigned the CETME to fire it. H&K got the rights to make a version for the German armed forces.

toad wrote:If I had a lathe (and a shop)I'd like to "reinvent" the original Spanish CETME 7.92 bullet as a .25 round. IIRC the 7.92 was based on the 7.92 Kurtz used in the original German assault rifles. The bullet was two part, the front part was a long streamlined aluminum ogive and the base was jacketed lead(?). It made for a light bullet that could be fired at high velocity out the short case but one that had a high BC for its weight so that it would retain velocity. Also it was reported to be controllable on full auto.
I imagine the terminal effects were nasty as I believe the bullets would have a tendency to flip when they hit anything relatively soft, the base being heavier than the nose.
The Spanish went with the NATO 7.62 X 51 ammunition and redesigned the CETME to fire it. H&K got the rights to make a version for the German armed forces.

The FAL was also originally designed around the Kurz round. Neck that down to somewhere in the 6 to 6.5mm range....

Is the type of exaggerated body taper you see in the 7.92 Kurz and 7.62x39 rounds really needed to properly extract steel cased ammo?

toad wrote:If I had a lathe (and a shop)I'd like to "reinvent" the original Spanish CETME 7.92 bullet as a .25 round. IIRC the 7.92 was based on the 7.92 Kurtz used in the original German assault rifles. The bullet was two part, the front part was a long streamlined aluminum ogive and the base was jacketed lead(?). It made for a light bullet that could be fired at high velocity out the short case but one that had a high BC for its weight so that it would retain velocity. Also it was reported to be controllable on full auto.
I imagine the terminal effects were nasty as I believe the bullets would have a tendency to flip when they hit anything relatively soft, the base being heavier than the nose.
The Spanish went with the NATO 7.62 X 51 ammunition and redesigned the CETME to fire it. H&K got the rights to make a version for the German armed forces.

Sounds a lot like the British .303 MkVII bullet, which had a lightweight aluminum or pressed wood front core with lead as the main core, inside a cupro-nickel jacket. This was done to create a 174 gr. spitzer that was the same length as the previous MkVI 215 gr. round nose bullet. The MkVII also had a reputation as a very good manstopper because the light nose caused it to tumble on impact.

Is the type of exaggerated body taper you see in the 7.92 Kurz and 7.62x39 rounds really needed to properly extract steel cased ammo?

Probably, and the roller delayed blowback used with the 8x33 would have exaggerated the problem. The bolt started unlocking and moving rearward very quickly. Some rifles had axial flutes in chamber to keep the case from sticking during extraction. That was a downside. The upside was 1200+ RPM for the MG42.