The Gun Counter

Not really a bad video, though it is unfortunate that the government seems to rather have you fight the murdering bastard with a fire extinguisher, rather than with your own firearm.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5VcSwejU ... re=related

it is assumed that you know what to do if you have a gun.

I've tried to figure this out in my workplace, I'm in a cubicle farm. I'm all the way in the corner of the room, but a distance from the only door, and nothing between me and the door that would stop a bullet. Of course, since I work in NYC, shooting back isn't an option for me.

Liabilities:
Low, cloth walls (no cover), and no concealment from close-up.
No proper weapons.
People around who will likely panic (if they even notice something's going on before it's too late).

Assets:
fire extinguisher on the wall behind me.
Claw hammer in bug-out bag (added after 9/11 when I read about people escaping the WTC by breaking thru interior walls with window cleaning tools).
Pocketknife in pocket.
Most importantly: Mindset.

I've concluded that there's no good way to ensure my survival. I figure I'll try to wait until his back is to me, then sneak up on him and brain him with the hammer or fire extinguisher. If he spots me before I'm close enough I'll yell as loud as I can to distract him while closing as quickly as possible, then keep pounding him until one of us stops moving. Like I said, no good method, but it beats hiding under my desk until he finds me and shoots me, since unless he's a complete idiot there's no path from me to the door for escape.

MarkD wrote:I've tried to figure this out in my workplace, I'm in a cubicle farm. I'm all the way in the corner of the room, but a distance from the only door, and nothing between me and the door that would stop a bullet. Of course, since I work in NYC, shooting back isn't an option for me.

Liabilities:
Low, cloth walls (no cover), and no concealment from close-up.
No proper weapons.
People around who will likely panic (if they even notice something's going on before it's too late).

Assets:
fire extinguisher on the wall behind me.
Claw hammer in bug-out bag (added after 9/11 when I read about people escaping the WTC by breaking thru interior walls with window cleaning tools).
Pocketknife in pocket.
Most importantly: Mindset.

I've concluded that there's no good way to ensure my survival. I figure I'll try to wait until his back is to me, then sneak up on him and brain him with the hammer or fire extinguisher. If he spots me before I'm close enough I'll yell as loud as I can to distract him while closing as quickly as possible, then keep pounding him until one of us stops moving. Like I said, no good method, but it beats hiding under my desk until he finds me and shoots me, since unless he's a complete idiot there's no path from me to the door for escape.

If it's a chemical extinguisher plan on discharging it. It's nasty shit if it gets in someone's face (good time-buying distraction), and the smokescreen effect will be a plus.

Greg wrote:

MarkD wrote:I've tried to figure this out in my workplace, I'm in a cubicle farm. I'm all the way in the corner of the room, but a distance from the only door, and nothing between me and the door that would stop a bullet. Of course, since I work in NYC, shooting back isn't an option for me.

Liabilities:
Low, cloth walls (no cover), and no concealment from close-up.
No proper weapons.
People around who will likely panic (if they even notice something's going on before it's too late).

Assets:
fire extinguisher on the wall behind me.
Claw hammer in bug-out bag (added after 9/11 when I read about people escaping the WTC by breaking thru interior walls with window cleaning tools).
Pocketknife in pocket.
Most importantly: Mindset.

I've concluded that there's no good way to ensure my survival. I figure I'll try to wait until his back is to me, then sneak up on him and brain him with the hammer or fire extinguisher. If he spots me before I'm close enough I'll yell as loud as I can to distract him while closing as quickly as possible, then keep pounding him until one of us stops moving. Like I said, no good method, but it beats hiding under my desk until he finds me and shoots me, since unless he's a complete idiot there's no path from me to the door for escape.

If it's a chemical extinguisher plan on discharging it. It's nasty shit if it gets in someone's face (good time-buying distraction), and the smokescreen effect will be a plus.

Yeah, I considered that too, it's a CO2 extinguisher. My concern was that then I'd also be advancing thru a cloud of the stuff.

Greg wrote:

MarkD wrote:I've tried to figure this out in my workplace, I'm in a cubicle farm. I'm all the way in the corner of the room, but a distance from the only door, and nothing between me and the door that would stop a bullet. Of course, since I work in NYC, shooting back isn't an option for me.

Liabilities:
Low, cloth walls (no cover), and no concealment from close-up.
No proper weapons.
People around who will likely panic (if they even notice something's going on before it's too late).

Assets:
fire extinguisher on the wall behind me.
Claw hammer in bug-out bag (added after 9/11 when I read about people escaping the WTC by breaking thru interior walls with window cleaning tools).
Pocketknife in pocket.
Most importantly: Mindset.

I've concluded that there's no good way to ensure my survival. I figure I'll try to wait until his back is to me, then sneak up on him and brain him with the hammer or fire extinguisher. If he spots me before I'm close enough I'll yell as loud as I can to distract him while closing as quickly as possible, then keep pounding him until one of us stops moving. Like I said, no good method, but it beats hiding under my desk until he finds me and shoots me, since unless he's a complete idiot there's no path from me to the door for escape.

If it's a chemical extinguisher plan on discharging it. It's nasty shit if it gets in someone's face (good time-buying distraction), and the smokescreen effect will be a plus.

Buys enough time to cave some asshat's head in. Putting up 1/2 inch thick steel plates under your desk works well, but the ABSOLUTE BEST way to prevent the situation from happening in the first place is to know the people you work with.

Yogimus wrote:

Greg wrote:

MarkD wrote:I've tried to figure this out in my workplace, I'm in a cubicle farm. I'm all the way in the corner of the room, but a distance from the only door, and nothing between me and the door that would stop a bullet. Of course, since I work in NYC, shooting back isn't an option for me.

Liabilities:
Low, cloth walls (no cover), and no concealment from close-up.
No proper weapons.
People around who will likely panic (if they even notice something's going on before it's too late).

Assets:
fire extinguisher on the wall behind me.
Claw hammer in bug-out bag (added after 9/11 when I read about people escaping the WTC by breaking thru interior walls with window cleaning tools).
Pocketknife in pocket.
Most importantly: Mindset.

I've concluded that there's no good way to ensure my survival. I figure I'll try to wait until his back is to me, then sneak up on him and brain him with the hammer or fire extinguisher. If he spots me before I'm close enough I'll yell as loud as I can to distract him while closing as quickly as possible, then keep pounding him until one of us stops moving. Like I said, no good method, but it beats hiding under my desk until he finds me and shoots me, since unless he's a complete idiot there's no path from me to the door for escape.

If it's a chemical extinguisher plan on discharging it. It's nasty shit if it gets in someone's face (good time-buying distraction), and the smokescreen effect will be a plus.

Buys enough time to cave some asshat's head in. Putting up 1/2 inch thick steel plates under your desk works well, but the ABSOLUTE BEST way to prevent the situation from happening in the first place is to know the people you work with.

Well, the steel plates would be a problem, first getting them, second transporting them to work on the subway, third getting them into the building without someone wondering wtf I was doing.

As for knowing my co-workers, I doubt very much it would be a co-worker I'd be dealing with. I work in a municipal building, open to the public. I'm on a secure floor, but we still get people who don't belong here sometimes, and a determined person would find a way in.

Admittedly an active shooter where I work is highly unlikely, but the tactical situation here is such that if it DID happen it would be very nasty. I have some general guidelines in place if it happens, but going home that night would require a lot of luck and/or a lot of God's intervention.

If you still have fire hoses at your workplace, they could make a good barrier/stairway denial tool.

Had one in my old workplace next to the stairwell. If threat was coming up the stairs, throw fire hose down the well and turn it on full blast. Not many are going to advance into one of those whipping around an enclosed column.

Or you could use to hit the goblin with the stream and knock him around. Of course, DO NOT pin him by focusing on his face for several minutes.

However, those hoses seem to be going away. In my current building I was told that it was due to liability. If the have the hose installed, it implies they need to train us in how to use them, and since training takes money, cheaper to pull the hoses out.

Just how much security do the metal detector entrances in most municipal building provide against armed gunmen. I've got a gut feeling that there are people coming and going that don't use those entrances??

Randy: Honestly, if I could get to the staircase, I could probably get out of the building. I'd have to traverse a pretty wide open area and two corridors, with a third intersecting corridor I'd have to bypass. About all the fire hose would do is impede other potential escapees.

toad: Not really, not without breaking in thru locked doors. Still, employees bypass the detectors.

I've war gamed this scenario for years now (ever since Columbine probably). In the situation I'm currently in, my best chance is to try to stay out of sight until I can get a clear, undetected approach then engage with something large/hard/heavy. There are a couple people here I would trust enough to work with, and a couple others who would probably offer to show the shooter where everyone is hiding in return for not being shot themselves.