OK, once again, I'm not understanding the following
(currently reading about de Soto's foray against the
Florida Indians)- how do you stick someone with a lance,
or sword, riding at speed, from a horse?
How is it that the blade doesn't get caught in the
target? I know that, with a sword, you're supposed
to keep your arm absolutely straight, but I don't
know why.
There has to be an immense amount of energy in the
point of the blade when it hits-formula anyone?
Let's see, small point, weight of blade, rider, mount and
speed of the above- I get that it will skewer.
But how does one retain the weapon?
Thank you.
Please explain the how of it
- Netpackrat
- Posts: 13986
- Joined: Fri Aug 15, 2008 11:04 pm
Re: Please explain the how of it
Lots of practice.
Cognosce teipsum et disce pati
"People come and go in our lives, especially the online ones. Some leave a fond memory, and some a bad taste." -Aesop
"People come and go in our lives, especially the online ones. Some leave a fond memory, and some a bad taste." -Aesop
- Dinochrome
- Posts: 390
- Joined: Tue Apr 26, 2011 12:14 am
Re: Please explain the how of it
I've always heard that the use of a sword (saber) from horseback was to slash the target. If the horseman doesn't go for an impaling thrust it should be easier to retain the sword. For a lance, I don't know. Maybe it's, "stick the lance in the enemy, lose the lance, draw the saber".
"Fair is fair; If somebody tries to kill you, kill them right back."
Captain Malcolm of Serenity
Captain Malcolm of Serenity
- Netpackrat
- Posts: 13986
- Joined: Fri Aug 15, 2008 11:04 pm
Re: Please explain the how of it
Not a horse rider, but from what I've read, the general idea with a lance is that you sort of raise your arm and let the lance pivot as you go past your victim, and then your forward motion will pull the lance out behind you as you continue on. Then raise the lance back to vertical and forward again for another thrust. Not something that you can just learn over knight.
Cognosce teipsum et disce pati
"People come and go in our lives, especially the online ones. Some leave a fond memory, and some a bad taste." -Aesop
"People come and go in our lives, especially the online ones. Some leave a fond memory, and some a bad taste." -Aesop
-
- Posts: 895
- Joined: Tue Aug 19, 2008 2:00 am
Re: Please explain the how of it
Somewhere, many years ago, in some obscure book, I read something of lancers. Lancers are light cavalry. Meant to harass and harry a line of infantry or artillery. The lance was lightweight, strong, and flexible. Able to be held one handed with the arm extended forward during the charge. As the lancer makes contact with his target, he pulls his arm back swiftly so that only 3 or 4 inches of the point penetrates, inflicting wounds and causing confusion. The object is NOT to skewer your target, as the rider would lose his lance and make him all but useless. A light cavalry charge was designed to make holes in the enemy line that could be followed up by heavy cavalry with sabers and subsequently, a foot charge by infantry. The best charge was carried out from the flank or an oblique angle to the infantry line. The lance gave the light cavalry the extra reach to get past a line of muskets and bayonets. To be a lancer you had to be the absolute best of the best of horsemen with the skill of a fencing master to handle the lance properly. They were the Top Gun pilots of their day. Like fighter pilots, the training was longer and more intense than most other military units of the time.
- HTRN
- Posts: 12401
- Joined: Wed Aug 20, 2008 3:05 am
Re: Please explain the how of it
Against platemaile, the preferred weapon is, IIRC, a warhammer or axe. The idea is to beat the armor hard enough to cause injuries inside. A sword doesn't do to well against it..Dinochrome wrote:I've always heard that the use of a sword (saber) from horseback was to slash the target.
Didn't PBS/Nova/etc do a show on this not so long ago?
HTRN, I would tell you that you are an evil fucker, but you probably get that a lot ~ Netpackrat
Describing what HTRN does as "antics" is like describing the wreck of the Titanic as "a minor boating incident" ~ First Shirt
Describing what HTRN does as "antics" is like describing the wreck of the Titanic as "a minor boating incident" ~ First Shirt
-
- Posts: 2645
- Joined: Wed Aug 20, 2008 5:00 pm
Re: Please explain the how of it
Used to be lancers would practice against tent pegs. The object was to lift the tent peg out of the ground on the point of the lance. I saw some photographs of this practice in a magazine back in the 1950's, as a very young child of course. Damned expensive and dangerous hobby.
When riding down fleeing infantry with the saber the standard practice was to do a back slash to the front of the grunt. If you tried to slash the back you often had a pack or leather helmet that would stop the blade from striking flesh.
Read the Sharpe's series of books for information on this.
In South America during the 19th century their were some pure cavalry vs. cavalry battles from the view point of lancers vs swordsmen, lancers vs. lancers, swordsmen vs. swordsmen. Usually the lancer had the advantage over the swordsmen because of reach. However the good swordsmen claimed they could parry a lance and close inside the reach of the lancer. Usually though the commander of sword equipped cavalry would try to get his unit to retreat from lancer units.
When riding down fleeing infantry with the saber the standard practice was to do a back slash to the front of the grunt. If you tried to slash the back you often had a pack or leather helmet that would stop the blade from striking flesh.
Read the Sharpe's series of books for information on this.
In South America during the 19th century their were some pure cavalry vs. cavalry battles from the view point of lancers vs swordsmen, lancers vs. lancers, swordsmen vs. swordsmen. Usually the lancer had the advantage over the swordsmen because of reach. However the good swordsmen claimed they could parry a lance and close inside the reach of the lancer. Usually though the commander of sword equipped cavalry would try to get his unit to retreat from lancer units.
- First Shirt
- Posts: 4378
- Joined: Mon Aug 18, 2008 11:32 pm
Re: Please explain the how of it
Back in the days of "The Raj" British cavalry practiced by "pig-sticking." Beaters would start the boar from cover, then the horsemen, armed with bamboo-shaft lances would try to ride down and kill the boar without killing themselves. (It was considered gauche to use a firearm, or to try and tackle the piggie on foot.) Apparently it was a dangerous enough activity that the powers-that-be tried to prohibit it, without great success. It normally involved one or two deaths each year, and any number of serious injuries. But it was considered great training for lancers and light cavalry.
But there ain't many troubles that a man caint fix, with seven hundred dollars and a thirty ought six."
Lindy Cooper Wisdom
Lindy Cooper Wisdom
- skb12172
- Posts: 7310
- Joined: Tue Aug 19, 2008 12:45 am
Re: Please explain the how of it
On a DeSoto? Just strap it to the hood, I guess...
There must be an end to this intimidation by those who come to this great country, but reject its culture.
-
- Posts: 105
- Joined: Tue Aug 19, 2008 1:28 am
Re: Please explain the how of it
...well, kinda, it was while reading the Contact: The Battle for America seriesOn a DeSoto
...have you read Mallinson'sBack in the days of "The Raj" British cavalry
Matthew Hervey series?
...love Sharpe; read 'em all three times,Read the Sharpe's series of books
even the wonderful contracted short stories for
The Sharpe Appreciation Society