Never thought of that!

[First Shirt]

In case I haven't mentioned it lately, I LOVE this bar!!!!

[randy]

An inconvenient truth that I often have to remind my USAF and USN friends of: http://www.strategypage.com/htmw/htmurp ... 41216.aspx

The fact of the matter is that wars are still ultimately won by the ground forces. As the army likes to point out, the ultimate air superiority weapon is your infantry occupying the enemy air bases. Everyone else (the navy and air force) is there to support the infantry in actually winning the war.

Quote I used to have over my desk, forget where I stole it from:

You can shoot down every MIG the Soviets employ, but if you RTB and the lead Soviet tank commander is having breakfast in your snack bar, Jack, you just lost the war! - A. Hogdriver

[Jericho941]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Piper_PA-48_Enforcer

http://www.edcoatescollection.com/ac3/C ... pT211.html

Interesting, but:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cessna_A-37_Dragonfly

[Yogimus]

Jet bad.

[Vonz90]

I'd rather they make a semi-stealthy (most bang for the least buck) new two seat A-10-ish type of aircraft with the big gun removable so you can load other payload for other missions.

Slow speed, big payload, long loiter time, short landing capability - sell it to the Navy too as a dual mission ASW and CAS airframe.

If you want to make a plane that can mount a GAU-8 and fly without it, you're either going to have a piss-weak ammo load or a massive airframe (i.e. land-based-only) to get around weight and balance concerns.

When people say that the A-10 is a plane built around a giant gun, they're hardly exaggerating. It is barely enough plane spread thin over a massive gun.

I probably should have said "a big gun". The GAU-8 is basically 60's technology. As good as it is, I'm pretty sure we could develop a better solution these days. Maybe one externally cooled barrel system using liquid propellant. Something like that.

[MarkD]

I'd rather they make a semi-stealthy (most bang for the least buck) new two seat A-10-ish type of aircraft with the big gun removable so you can load other payload for other missions.

Slow speed, big payload, long loiter time, short landing capability - sell it to the Navy too as a dual mission ASW and CAS airframe.

If you want to make a plane that can mount a GAU-8 and fly without it, you're either going to have a piss-weak ammo load or a massive airframe (i.e. land-based-only) to get around weight and balance concerns.

When people say that the A-10 is a plane built around a giant gun, they're hardly exaggerating. It is barely enough plane spread thin over a massive gun.

I probably should have said "a big gun". The GAU-8 is basically 60's technology. As good as it is, I'm pretty sure we could develop a better solution these days. Maybe one externally cooled barrel system using liquid propellant. Something like that.

Why would you use liquid propellant? My understanding is that solid propellants give much more power per weight/volume than liquids.

Or did you mean liquid coolant for the barrel?

[blackeagle603]

30mm a bit overkill for CAS?

Unless the objective is to have a tank killer replacement for the A-10, seems like a GAU-19 fifty call, a 3 barrel 20mm like the M197 (used in Broncos and Cobras), or both on a fixed wing platform, would be as heavy as you'd need (with the upside of being able to carry more rounds). Seems like a 20mm from above is a bit of heartburn for armor anyway but I'd leave that for the legs and tankers here to comment on.


If you've got room throw a Mk19 grenade launcher in just for grins and to spread the love over a wider area on the ground.

[JustinR]

You were at Redstone, and what? You don't call, you don't write, like, what, we're chopped liver or something
And I was even in Huntsville on Sunday!

LOL...Well being on reserve, I never know where I'll end up for an overnight. Right now I'm in Greensburo, NC. I happened to get a trip with an early morning flight to Huntsville and had all day free. My F/O and I spent the day at the Space and Rocket Center, and happened to be there in time for the bus tour of Redstone as well. A day well spent.

[SoupOrMan]

I'd love a proper successor to the B-25G. (The A-10 is more a successor to the IL-2 than anything else.)

[Termite]

Be nice to have an airframe that could carry a serious amount of armor plate.

More armor weight means more horsepower means more fuel for bigger engines means more weight means more.........you get the picture.

Realistically, the A10 was designed to kill tanks in a medium threat environment, with friendly fast movers providing top cap air cover. Ground fire from .50, 20mm-23mm, and short-medium range SAMs were the main threat. It is armored accordingly.

For lower threat CAS, you need to protect the pilots from ground fire up to .50cal........maybe 20-23mm. Self-sealing fuel tanks add protection for that area, twin engines give redundancy. The plane should be able to limp home on one engine after jettisoning its external stores. A GAU-19 or twin M2s combined with a 40mm "chunker" like the Mk-19 would be excellent for pudgies in the open, Hiluxes with MGs/cannons in the bed, and most buildings. 2.75" rocket launchers can be loaded with HE, WP, or flechette loads. One could even hang a TOW or Hellfire on the plane if needed.
Serious STOL capability(T/O & land in less than 600') means giving up speed on the higher end(parasitic drag), unless we are talking VTOL jets. Which burn huge amounts of fuel, have limited loiter times, and can't lift a lot.

There is no perfect CAS plane, just the most practical & efficient for the required job.