MANPADS

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D5CAV
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MANPADS

Post by D5CAV »

On another thread was a discussion on how most of us would trade quite a bit for a Javelin (or three).

From my time in tanks, I have some ideas on how I can deal with enemy armor. While I won't turn down a gift of a few Javelins, I wouldn't give up any of my children for them either.

We had a number of exercises with A10s. While not as one-sided as you might think, I have a healthy respect for them, even more than my respect for PGMs.

Fortunately, I never had to deal with a battlefield where I had an air threat. If I did, my children better behave, or they might get traded for some MANPADS.

US is now sending MANPADS to Ukraine: https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2022/3/1 ... to-ukraine
But moving those amounts of weaponry into the largest conflict in Europe since World War II carries with it risks that some could fall into the wrong hands – a possibility the West has considered.

“Frankly, we believe that risk is worth taking right now because the Ukrainians are fighting so skillfully with the tools at their disposal and they’re using them so creatively,” a senior US defence official said on Friday when asked about that danger.
Frankly, I'm amazed that more civilian airliners haven't been shot down given the number of MANPADS that have been "lost" in Libya, Afghanistan, Syria, etc. It may be that ISIS or Taliban or whoever (rightly) recognize that they are a lot more valuable to keep in reserve for a rainy day when you have to deal with an A10 or Su25.

Of course, Russia says it's a bad idea:
“We warned the United States that the orchestrated pumping of weapons from a number of countries is not just a dangerous move, it is a move that turns these convoys into legitimate targets,” Russian Deputy Foreign Minister Sergey Ryabkov told state television.

He said Moscow had warned “about the consequences of the thoughtless transfer to Ukraine of weapons like man-portable air defence systems, anti-tank missile systems and so on”.
Turnabout is fair play, so I hope Vlad remembers this when I ask him можно for a few (dozen) Verbas when our American "Mooselini" gets elected.
None are more hopelessly enslaved than those who falsely believe they are free.” Johann Wolfgang von Goethe
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HTRN
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Re: MANPADS

Post by HTRN »

D5CAV wrote: Tue Mar 15, 2022 8:59 am From my time in tanks, I have some ideas on how I can deal with enemy armor.
https://youtube.com/shorts/2_fDQmmeLqI?feature=share

:ugeek:
HTRN, I would tell you that you are an evil fucker, but you probably get that a lot ~ Netpackrat

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Vonz90
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Re: MANPADS

Post by Vonz90 »

D5CAV wrote: Tue Mar 15, 2022 8:59 am Frankly, I'm amazed that more civilian airliners haven't been shot down given the number of MANPADS that have been "lost" in Libya, Afghanistan, Syria, etc. It may be that ISIS or Taliban or whoever (rightly) recognize that they are a lot more valuable to keep in reserve for a rainy day when you have to deal with an A10 or Su25.
I am not an air guy but this used to get covered in the intel briefings when I was in A-Stan (edit '09-10 for reference). The Taliban still had a fair number of SA-7s and even some Stingers left over and would shoot at aircraft when they could. To my knowledge they never hit anything (definitely not in the year I was there).

The Intel guys said that lack of maintenance and proper storage plus they did not really know to use them made them close to useless.

IDK if exactly true, but it does fit the data.
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randy
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Re: MANPADS

Post by randy »

D5CAV wrote: Tue Mar 15, 2022 8:59 am Frankly, I'm amazed that more civilian airliners haven't been shot down given the number of MANPADS that have been "lost" in Libya, Afghanistan, Syria, etc.
One reason is that civilian airliners only operate in the envelope of MANPADS during take off and landing. At cruising altitudes they are beyond the range of any MANPAD I know of. Makes it a lot harder to get into a position to take a shot at an airliner.

The Malaysian and Ukrainian airliners shot down over the past few years were shot down using full up SAM systems operated by the Russians, excuse me, "Ukrainian Separatists" and Iranians respectively, not shoulder fired weapons.
...even before I read MHI, my response to seeing a poster for the stars of the latest Twilight movies was "I see 2 targets and a collaborator".
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D5CAV
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Re: MANPADS

Post by D5CAV »

Vonz90 wrote: Tue Mar 15, 2022 1:53 pm
D5CAV wrote: Tue Mar 15, 2022 8:59 am Frankly, I'm amazed that more civilian airliners haven't been shot down given the number of MANPADS that have been "lost" in Libya, Afghanistan, Syria, etc. It may be that ISIS or Taliban or whoever (rightly) recognize that they are a lot more valuable to keep in reserve for a rainy day when you have to deal with an A10 or Su25.
I am not an air guy but this used to get covered in the intel briefings when I was in A-Stan (edit '09-10 for reference). The Taliban still had a fair number of SA-7s and even some Stingers left over and would shoot at aircraft when they could. To my knowledge they never hit anything (definitely not in the year I was there).

The Intel guys said that lack of maintenance and proper storage plus they did not really know to use them made them close to useless.

IDK if exactly true, but it does fit the data.
That makes sense. I never got to play with any MANPADS, even the ones that were around in the antedeluvian era when I was in. They look like they have a lot of expensive sensors and electronics that don't take well to bouncing around in a donkey cart.

I still want some...
None are more hopelessly enslaved than those who falsely believe they are free.” Johann Wolfgang von Goethe
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