1632 Series...Whaddya Think?

[Rich]

Another spinoff novel in the same series is Time Spike, though it is different enough to stand alone. About a southern Illinois max security prison thrown back into the dinosaur era. For the first time in the series we are getting a glimpse of how the modern world is coping with the disappearence of Grantville. And it ain't pretty.

The writing is similar to what we have seen in the other books, even though Flint has a different partner in this one. This makes me believe that the co-author, Marilyn Kosmatka, is the actual writer, and Flint being more of an editor (which function he is very good at).

[skb12172]

Like what, if you don't mind my asking; because I thought most of the choices were pretty sound given the circumstances. Of course plot devices are what they are...

Sure. And keep in mind, this is just off the top of my head. If I were to re-read the first two novels and take notes, I'm sure I could offer more specific examples.

1) Offering German refugees citizenship and the franchise a mere 3 months after moving into Grantville. Considering that many of these folks had been enemies until they were soundly defeated strikes me as naive. For every Hans Richter, I'll show you a group of folks who will grab whatever uptime technology they can find and run to Richelieu for their reward.

2) Giving the uptime medications to the Spanish. Again, I'm with Underwood on this one. Charity begins at home.

3) Not keeping a tighter clamp on uptime technology in general. His open door policy allowed the "Papists" to get ahold of two sets of scuba gear, for pete's sake. No telling how many breechloading rifles, shotguns, etc. have gone missing. When you are so grossly outnumbered, giving away your only advantage should be done judiciously. Stearns' choices in this matter just struck me as a little too Kumbaya for my taste. Loral and Chinese rockets, anyone?

4) The entire wasteful issue of the Kellys and their "skunkworks" would have left me livid, if I were Colonel Jesse Wood. Stearns would have had my resignation on the spot. If a little waste was so acceptable, then lack of waste should have been even more precious and worth it's weight in gold...literally. I would offer to continue teaching his pilots as a civilian contractor, but my instructor's fee would be twice my previous AF salary. Likewise, since the Kellys were getting the same support for doing nothing, every serviceable Belle and Gustav delivered would henceforth cost 3 times as much as it did previously. Want competition? Buy from the Kellys, instead. Wanna throw me in prison for treason/insubordination? Build your own damn airplanes and train your own damn pilots.

Again, so far in my reading, all of these things have either been a non-issue, or they have worked to Stearns' advantage. Knowing human nature as I do, I'm not so sure it would play out in this manner.

However, Chris, you always make me consider things differently than I otherwise would have. If you differ, I'm ready to consider your point of view.

[skb12172]

Oh, let me also add that I'm with Chris on the advantages of a major, research I university bringing the surrounding area up to the 1930's in short order. Really, even in 1632, just about all the physical tools already existed to bring the entire world up to 1880 or so, given a few years. For the most part, all the physical tools were the same or similar. The difference was in the knowledge of what was possible. The most obvious examples would be the monitors that Admiral Simpson was constructing, as well as Gustav II Adolf's master ship builders producing a Ship Of The Line, merely from having the 19th century blueprints in the book provided by the Dungeons and Dragons boys.

[skb12172]

Well, the first instinct would be to hold on to power and your technical superiority. Not sure that in his shoes I would have had the saavy to take all greater considerations into account. Given your argument, it seems survival lies in doing what Stearns did. Still, giving your heart and soul to such a course of action couldn't be easy. Being so distinctive in this more primitive time, one would be tempted to hold on to that advantage, no matter what.

I do find it odd that a continent of serfs would so readily embrace the CoC and the idea of democracy. Likewise, all the nobles that willingly abdicated their positions in the hopes of becoming titans of industry or politics. Even in King Arthur's Court, the Connecticut Yankee didn't have that smooth of a ride.

[Kommander]

Seriously guys, I hear stuff like that and all I think is what you're really saying is "Too much thinking, not enough blowing shit up".

The fact is, Europe in the 17th century WAS "court intrigue". Most "wars" lasted for a battle or two over the course of the summer, then the rest of the year was nobles plotting and scheming while the peasants grew food, and starved to death.

That concept of warfare didn't REALLY change until Napoleon; though we saw some seeds of it in the new model army.

Being historically accurate doesn't alleviate the fact that I found good chunk of the book to be rather boring. Others might enjoy those parts if they are into "court intrigue", but I did not. As a fan of both Raymond Chandler and recently H.P Lovecraft I do not need a bunch of explosions and a high body count to keep me entertained.

[SeekHer]

I've enjoyed the series as it has progressed through the volumes (have read six, bought the seventh and will get the eighth next time down)...

As to accepting CofC and democracy by the serfs is totally credible as anything is better then the position they would have been in, growing crops and maybe retaining 10% of it for their own use the rest as tax or to the land owner as share crop...

I also liked the series by S.M. Sterling, Island in the Sea of Time where an island is transported back in time well before Alexander...

[Greg]

=I do find it odd that a continent of serfs would so readily embrace the CoC and the idea of democracy. Likewise, all the nobles that willingly abdicated their positions in the hopes of becoming titans of industry or politics. Even in King Arthur's Court, the Connecticut Yankee didn't have that smooth of a ride.

No, that part I found plausible. Where do you think support for the Reformation came from, anyway? The Enlightenment has the same roots, and at very nearly the same time.

[skb12172]

OK, if I grant you the CoC and the Serfs, that still doesn't explain the capitulation by many of the nobles. Anyone have a theory for that?

[skb12172]

That does make more sense. After some re-reading and a bit of historical research, I also now realize that even a Duke might only rule an area the size of an average county in Kentucky. Not that great of a gig, considering.

[toad]

Really liked the first book. Difficult to keep track of where I was in the following books. I think one of the basic problems is that you would need a library of books for all the stories that would be generated by the Ring of Fire.

Too this day we have a potential problem in the form of large pools of people lacking sanitation and inoculation serving as pools for old and new diseases. People weakened by one disease can serve as a breeding ground for another.

Sometimes the worst thing you can do to an enemy is to give him knowledge.

One of the Gazette short story plots that sticks in my memory is one in which two down time Catholic Clerics discover the catalog system of the school library. This they believe is the most important thing the up timers brought back.