Stolen guns - Update: items found, prosecution pending

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Darrell
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Re: Stolen guns - Update: items found, prosecution pending

Post by Darrell »

Aegis wrote:Evidently, after bringing them all in, the kids all started to roll on each other. The housesitting girl let them in for the party, then led them down to the safe so they could break it open.
This reminds me--there was a recent thread at arfcom with many pics, showing how flimsy safe internals are, even expensive ones. They showed the lockwork and door internals of a $4,000 Winchester gun safe. While it looked substantial from the outside, with a lot of locking bolts, seeing inside the door revealed that the bolts are attached to flimsy sheet metal brackets and throws. Prying the door open would be no big deal.
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Langenator
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Re: Stolen guns - Update: items found, prosecution pending

Post by Langenator »

Darrell wrote:
Aegis wrote:Evidently, after bringing them all in, the kids all started to roll on each other. The housesitting girl let them in for the party, then led them down to the safe so they could break it open.
This reminds me--there was a recent thread at arfcom with many pics, showing how flimsy safe internals are, even expensive ones. They showed the lockwork and door internals of a $4,000 Winchester gun safe. While it looked substantial from the outside, with a lot of locking bolts, seeing inside the door revealed that the bolts are attached to flimsy sheet metal brackets and throws. Prying the door open would be no big deal.
Find a dealer that sells Graffunder safes. They're real safes, not Residential Security Containers, which is most likely what that Winchester was.
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HTRN
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Re: Stolen guns - Update: items found, prosecution pending

Post by HTRN »

A RSC is certified to keep a single man with tools out for 5 minutes. Even a good safe will only keep a determined cracker armed with tools out for an hour or so, unless you invest in a real safe or vault door(and I don't mean the ones sold by gunsafe companies).

The first mistake was that the housesitter and therefore everybody knew where the safe was. They can't break into it, if they can't find it.
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JAG2955
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Re: Stolen guns - Update: items found, prosecution pending

Post by JAG2955 »

I would love to know more about the safe. If a few 16 year olds can pry it open with what was found in a guy's house/basement, what kind was it? Stack-on? Was it bolted down, or heavy enough to not drop on its back? What did they pry it open with?
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Darrell
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Re: Stolen guns - Update: items found, prosecution pending

Post by Darrell »

Langenator wrote:
Darrell wrote:
Aegis wrote:Evidently, after bringing them all in, the kids all started to roll on each other. The housesitting girl let them in for the party, then led them down to the safe so they could break it open.
This reminds me--there was a recent thread at arfcom with many pics, showing how flimsy safe internals are, even expensive ones. They showed the lockwork and door internals of a $4,000 Winchester gun safe. While it looked substantial from the outside, with a lot of locking bolts, seeing inside the door revealed that the bolts are attached to flimsy sheet metal brackets and throws. Prying the door open would be no big deal.
Find a dealer that sells Graffunder safes. They're real safes, not Residential Security Containers, which is most likely what that Winchester was.
Yeah, I was looking at Graffunder safes earlier. Most gun safe doors are just sheet metal. The Graffunder I saw had a 1" thick plate steel door front. Impressive, and extremely heavy. Not to mention expensive...
Eppur si muove--Galileo
Langenator
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Re: Stolen guns - Update: items found, prosecution pending

Post by Langenator »

Darrell wrote:
Langenator wrote:
Darrell wrote: This reminds me--there was a recent thread at arfcom with many pics, showing how flimsy safe internals are, even expensive ones. They showed the lockwork and door internals of a $4,000 Winchester gun safe. While it looked substantial from the outside, with a lot of locking bolts, seeing inside the door revealed that the bolts are attached to flimsy sheet metal brackets and throws. Prying the door open would be no big deal.
Find a dealer that sells Graffunder safes. They're real safes, not Residential Security Containers, which is most likely what that Winchester was.
Yeah, I was looking at Graffunder safes earlier. Most gun safe doors are just sheet metal. The Graffunder I saw had a 1" thick plate steel door front. Impressive, and extremely heavy. Not to mention expensive...
I'm not sure exactly how thick the steel is on mine...but I paid $4190, delivered, back in 2005. Although I did get a bit of a discount, since I got one that had been ordered, and then the buyer bailed after the safe had already been built.
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HTRN
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Re: Stolen guns - Update: items found, prosecution pending

Post by HTRN »

Darrell wrote:Find a dealer that sells Graffunder safes. They're real safes, not Residential Security Containers, which is most likely what that Winchester was.
Yeah, I was looking at Graffunder safes earlier. Most gun safe doors are just sheet metal. The Graffunder I saw had a 1" thick plate steel door front. Impressive, and extremely heavy. Not to mention expensive...
Doors don't need to be that thick. Remember it's most likely going to be a pry attack. Personally, I'd look into a Sturdy, get all the lovely options(7 gauge carcass - almost a 1/4" thick), a stainless guard around the lock dial to deter torch attacks, dual locking dials, etc.

Something that would be a deterrent to all but the most determined and skilled of burglers.
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Vonz90
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Re: Stolen guns - Update: items found, prosecution pending

Post by Vonz90 »

Get an alarm. Any safe is to start if the thieves have unlimited time.
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Aegis
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Re: Stolen guns - Update: items found, prosecution pending

Post by Aegis »

JAG2955 wrote:I would love to know more about the safe. If a few 16 year olds can pry it open with what was found in a guy's house/basement, what kind was it? Stack-on? Was it bolted down, or heavy enough to not drop on its back? What did they pry it open with?
It wasn't much of a safe. One of the cheap Sentry RSCs that he bought from Lowes about 14 years ago. Not sure what they pried it open with, but they apparently dumped some sort of caustic liquid on it in an attempt to... I dunno, melt through the locking bars? I can't imagine they were overly smart thieves. Surprisingly, nothing that they didn't manage to steal was damaged in the attempt.
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Kommander
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Re: Stolen guns - Update: items found, prosecution pending

Post by Kommander »

So they did not get it all they way open but they pried the top up and got some stuff out that way? One of the pics shows what appears to be an AR inside. I do think the lesson here, other than be careful who you have watch your house, is that putting a bunch of NFA stuff in a cheap safe is a bad idea. Your safe should be a refection of your collection, and the bigger and more expensive the collection gets, so should the safe.
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