12ga,10ga,8ga,4ga FH; 585HE/700HE; Other Big bores--

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hubel585
Posts: 153
Joined: Tue Aug 30, 2011 4:27 am

Re: 12ga,10ga,8ga,4ga FH; 585HE/700HE; Other Big bores--

Post by hubel585 » Wed Dec 28, 2011 3:16 am

Here is picture of 4 long cases, top being a Rocky Mtn Cartridge
3.5" turned brass 20ga. Next a RMC 3.5" turned brass 12ga.
3rd down our 3.85" 12ga FH we made from BMG brass. Bottom
a RMC 3.85" turned brass 12ga FH case.

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Next picture shows one of the old ways they locked slugs
into paper cases. Many old slugs had a wide deep groove
which made it possible to crimp that way.

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Next pictures shows bullet jackets made from a copper tubing caps.
Caps are the ones they solder on to copper pipes, and they made
a die and punch to form them to a good nose shape and
size. Then they fill them from rear with lead.
Example; 1/2" cap does 700cal and 12ga with
right dies and punches.

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Last the 2nd gun we put the 585HE long belted case in,
a Ruger 77 bolt action. it has a heavy 585 cal barrel,
and it is a real strong action....Ed

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SoupOrMan
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Re: 12ga,10ga,8ga,4ga FH; 585HE/700HE; Other Big bores--

Post by SoupOrMan » Wed Dec 28, 2011 5:46 pm

Wow. I never thought about using plumbing endcaps for jackets. That's pretty wild.
Remember, folks, you can't spell "douche" without "Che."

“PET PARENTS?” You’re not a “pet parent.” You’re a pet owner. Unless you’ve committed an unnatural act that succeeded in spite of biology. - Glenn Reynolds

Greg
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Re: 12ga,10ga,8ga,4ga FH; 585HE/700HE; Other Big bores--

Post by Greg » Wed Dec 28, 2011 6:32 pm

HTRN wrote:
MarkD wrote:Awaiting HTRN's statement-of-purpose in 3-2-1.....
Because BIGGER IS BETTER. :mrgreen:
Like a hyper 2 year-old who's gotten so excited playing he's gone manic.

MOAR!!!!!!

This is pretty entertaining and some if it is pretty clever... but constantly chasing the bigger and better thrill- can be fun for a while but you're never really going to be happy.

[spoiler]Actually it makes me think of a certain Buddy Hackett routine that involved thin walls, noisy neighbors and a lamp. And trying to get some sleep. Damn I miss Buddy Hackett.[/spoiler]
Maybe we're just jaded, but your villainy is not particularly impressive. -Ennesby

If you know what you're doing, you're not learning anything. -Unknown
Sanity is the process by which you continually adjust your beliefs so they are predictively sound. -esr

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AZMARK
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Re: 12ga,10ga,8ga,4ga FH; 585HE/700HE; Other Big bores--

Post by AZMARK » Wed Dec 28, 2011 7:16 pm

SoupOrMan wrote:Wow. I never thought about using plumbing endcaps for jackets. That's pretty wild.
You ain't seen nothin' yet. 8-)
My favorite story of his ended with "...and so he went out the back door in his bathrobe, flipped the AK to 'Afrikaner', and started hosing the baboons off his tennis court." - Tam

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HTRN
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Re: 12ga,10ga,8ga,4ga FH; 585HE/700HE; Other Big bores--

Post by HTRN » Thu Dec 29, 2011 3:56 pm

AZMARK wrote:
SoupOrMan wrote:Wow. I never thought about using plumbing endcaps for jackets. That's pretty wild.
You ain't seen nothin' yet. 8-)
The three biggest suppliers of jackets are Corbin, Sierra, and Berger. Berger offers a huge variety of rifle jackets, but nothing over .308. Sierra only offers 3 different Jackets, and they're for rifles. Corbin offers both rifle and pistol jackets.. HOWEVER, if you want long heavy jackets, you have to find one of the boutique jacket makers and hope he A) makes them and B) doesn't charge an arm and a leg.

Corbin, and I believe RSE both make jacket making dies, for making jackets from common copper tubing.
HTRN, I would tell you that you are an evil fucker, but you probably get that a lot ~ Netpackrat

Describing what HTRN does as "antics" is like describing the wreck of the Titanic as "a minor boating incident" ~ First Shirt

hubel585
Posts: 153
Joined: Tue Aug 30, 2011 4:27 am

Re: 12ga,10ga,8ga,4ga FH; 585HE/700HE; Other Big bores--

Post by hubel585 » Fri Jan 06, 2012 4:53 am

Here are couple more pictures of longer bullets
in sabots, loaded in plastic cases, with the
roll crimp down against the sabot. Both are
ideas tested by European Cartridge in Greece,
who make the US-S slugs. Both longer bullets
pictured have the locked on base that their
other US-S slugs have, for smooth bore accuracy.
2nd picture shows a deep hollow roll crimper
for doing slugs like these.Ed

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We also had RMC make us a long brass 28ga case.
It is 3.25" long as shown in picture. They could be
3" or whatever you would want. The 550 Mag rifled barrels
are perfect bore for them, and we did one
in a Mossy 695 bolt gun, 2nd picture...Added heavy barrel.
It is shown next to a 505 Gibbs brass
case 1st picture to show that it isn't a puny case.
And chamber still fires plastic 28ga like the
new Brenekke slugs just out.Ed

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hubel585
Posts: 153
Joined: Tue Aug 30, 2011 4:27 am

Re: 12ga,10ga,8ga,4ga FH; 585HE/700HE; Other Big bores--

Post by hubel585 » Wed Jan 11, 2012 8:36 am

First picture is an RC4 brand slug I see is available
down under. It has locked base like Brenekke.
And locked on without discarding petals, like US-S.

And 2nd picture is a group fired with RC4 slugs
by fellow on NitroExpress forums from a good
double 12ga, 2 left and 2 rights at 25yds.
This shows the possibilities of working with smoothbores,
rather than not trying to make them work.

3rd picture is a discarding sabot base slug, and with
four discarding sabot carriers, with centered
penetrating solid bullet, from France.Ed

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In earlier thread I mentioned the long brass 28ga case
we setup. Well here is picture of a revolving 28ga
we will try to get later on and put in heavy barrel
and longer chamber and use brass 28ga cases.Ed

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hubel585
Posts: 153
Joined: Tue Aug 30, 2011 4:27 am

Re: 12ga,10ga,8ga,4ga FH; 585HE/700HE; Other Big bores--

Post by hubel585 » Thu Jan 19, 2012 12:22 am

Some more slug and sabot ideas folks are doing.

First is a long pointed slug with locked on base,
It goes to target with base,can work smoothbore.

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Second is picture of Hexolit sabot base slug
with petals expanded, sure would make bad wound.

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Third shows a variety of Gualandi slugs you can
get for reloading, and we're finding that these
locked base slugs, Brenekke/USS style slugs, are
giving good accuracy in smooth barrels which can
save when doing heavy barrels.Weights shown in
grams, get our weights in grains multiply by 15.4..Ed

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hubel585
Posts: 153
Joined: Tue Aug 30, 2011 4:27 am

Re: 12ga,10ga,8ga,4ga FH; 585HE/700HE; Other Big bores--

Post by hubel585 » Fri Jan 20, 2012 10:41 am

Here are some more sabot/slug and loading concepts.

First is Alcan 2.75" paper case with Dixie 600gr slug,
with the side of the case crimped into the relief/lube
groove of the Dixie slug.The groove in the Dixie isn't
quite as deep as the groove in the Fosbury slug shown
in earlier post, but still seems to crimp fairly tight.

Image

Next are various slugs in 12ga REM sabots that take
57 cal slugs and bullets.Those sabots are from the REM
Accutip loadings. In picture you can see one of the
REM 385gr jkt bullets they use. Also is sabot
with 20ga cast Lyman. On right sabot with hardcast 585 cal
640gr lead bullet, the ones I use in my 585HE wildcat
case. I sized it down a little, perfect fit.
Also the .575 cal Dixie Gunworks lead slugs will do.

Also shown is a long pointed 55 Boys bullet in one,
fairly tight fit.We cut back .3" of bullet off so it
fit for length in sabot and is 750gr.

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Third are 3.5" brass and plastic with the REM sabot and
the 750gr pointed slugs in them.In all the sabot work we
and others have done, trying to get accuracy and high
speeds together, maybe there is such a thing as too
much plastic. IE, sabots too thick on the sides if doing
50cal or smaller in 12ga sabots, for heavier slugs
at high speeds. Thinner sides may discard more evenly at
the greater pressures and violence of high speeds.
Thin sides may have less give so that sabot grips slug
better to impart spin in rifled use. Example in
smoothbore use is the USS slugs, where the brass slug
is .629" with thin discarding petals that have proven to
be very accurate. And with both reasonable priced sabot
offerings the last few years being undersize, accuracy
problems, etc, maybe time to try something else.

Got to find whole bunch of these sabots. Are these pictured
12ga REMs the only 58cal ones around? I can't find others,
and maybe we can find where these are made. As I have
huge numbers of the 585 slugs, which by the way I think
is best hunting combination, without extremely heavy slugs
which suffer for the speeds needed for longer range use.
It is hard lead, good for big game.And my guy can make many,
many more if needed whether for 585HE rifles
or in sabots if we can find some.ED

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hubel585
Posts: 153
Joined: Tue Aug 30, 2011 4:27 am

Re: 12ga,10ga,8ga,4ga FH; 585HE/700HE; Other Big bores--

Post by hubel585 » Thu Jan 26, 2012 7:03 am

Some more sabot and slug ideas, discarding types
and locked on base types.

First picture of 20ga Buckhamer pulled apart. The bunch
I have were pulled apart, the slug won't lock back in
tight, into the base.

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Second is various 20ga sabot/slug ideas some using
buckhammer sabot bases that a bunch of 458 cal lead
slugs and jackted slugs I have, lock into real tight.
The 458 lead ones are 400gr, jkt are 350gr.

And I got some empty SPW 20 gauge sabots, and 20ga
Buckhammer slugs lock into them real tight.I have
many of these slugs. These slugs are 440gr.

Also is 3" 20ga FED factory sabot shell and one of
discarding sabots out of the case. Also a 3.5" 20ga
Hastings 3.5" load with black locked on base sabot,
and sabots out of the case and couple 20 brass
3.5" RMC cases.

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Next is variety of 12ga sabots with 50cal slugs
in them.2 white and the pink sabot are FED, The black
is Hornady, With a 50cal long bullet .
The grey, is a BPI with .504" cast 440gr slug.
I wish the BPI was full size like the others
and fit rifled barrels tight for accuracy.........

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Last 12ga SPWs from Slug-R-US(30 cents ea) with various
50 cal slugs locked in tight, and shown with one out of
a factory load, the dark colored one. 50cal 385gr
Great Plains ML slugs lock in perfect for a lighter
loading. Other ML slugs will do and a few of
the Dixie Gunworks 50cal slugs lock in also...Ed


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